Interviews of Robert Ian Crowe

In this first interview of three (EL15/3/1/1), Shirley Swinton interviews her brother, Robert Crowe (b. 1954, Rinteln, Germany) about his childhood, schooldays and early working life. Robert's father was an NCO with the 16th/15th Lancers and based in Germany when Robert was born. The family returned to East Lothian and stayed first of all with family at Kilduff Farm. Robert talks about his wider family connections in the region. His grandparents stayed in new council housing at Athelstaneford where they had been moved from nearby ex-army huts.

Robert's dad joined the police force and was posted to Buckhaven but left after a while, partly because of the poor wages. Robert remarks that an uncle, Henry Cowe, was able to earn 3 times the police salary by driving a lorry and so his father got a job with Dalkeith Transport. Robert also talks in detail about his memories of Haddington Public School and the Knox Institute. One anecdote is of taking in money each Monday morning. Some of the money was for school lunches and the rest was entered into a bank book, filled out by the child themselves. Both Shirley and Robert remember this, but have no recollection of what happened to the money thereafter.

Robert was streamed into a technical class (T) when he moved to secondary school and he describes how the T boys got to use mechanical saws etc. while the T girls studied home crafts and he remembered many of the girls would have preferred the subjects studies by the boys. Although Robert moved up to B class and was on the point of entering the A stream, he chose to leave school as soon as he could. He puts this decision down to the expectation by the school that the pupils were being prepared for work and said this attitude was consolidated by his own parents.

Robert then goes on to describe his early working life which started with a trainee job as a TV engineer with Knox and Noon in Haddington. At one point, Robert signed up for the Royal Marines and went off to train alongside 600 other recruits. He talks about the initial training, sharing anecdotes about, for example, the point where he had to jump off a diving board into a very large swimming pool (although he couldn't swim and didn't want to admit this). Although Robert subsequently decided to buy himself out of the marines, he says that the training was very worthwhile and taught him how to look after himself. Towards the end of the interview he returns to memories of his childhood and youth and said that he felt this had been a good time to be alive and where his community had felt very safe and there was no class distinction among his peers.

EL153/1/3 interview 2 of 3.

In this interview, (2 of 3) Robert Crowe talks about his decision to join the Lothian and Peebles Constabulary, the recruitment process, initial training and working as a young policeman in Prestonpans. In an often harrowing interview, Robert reflects that he can see now why his early police training was carried out in a certain way: although he admits at the time he didn't appreciate this, or understand how difficult it was to prepare anyone for life as a policeman.

Robert joined the police force at 19 and on his first day of training the recruits were taken to the city mortuary, a visit which left a lasting impression on him. The mortuary was then in the Cowgate part of Edinburgh and Robert also talks about the location of smaller mortuaries around the region, which are often attached to police stations or the local cemetery. After initial training in Edinburgh, Robert was sworn in at the Edinburgh sherriff court and then assigned to work in Prestonpans. After further residential training at Tulliallan police training college, Robert became part of the team providing 24-hour service at Prestonpans. He recalls one death, a road traffic accident involving a young boy, which has always stayed with him. The boy, from Glasgow, had been on holiday with family and staying at holiday accommodation at Port Seton which, at that time, was a collection of old huts, train carriages and sheds and he recalls the poor conditions there. He remarks that Prestonpans was known as Dodge City at that time and recalls there was terrible levels of crime and poverty. Part of the problem centred around the Orange Lodge and their clashes with the Catholic population. Orange walks would often start at 4 or 6am and there was often trouble, which Robert found incomprehensible. Robert also relates a number of anecdotes about his first months in the force when, he later realised, he was often being tested to see how he would react in different situations or to determine how much he would put up with. Towards the end of the interview, Robert again returns to the subject of dealing with terrible incidents, recalling one night he was called out to a fire in Danderhall where 3 children were trapped in a fire. The children couldn't be rescued and Robert remembered how the Inspector had opened up the local bar to serve up double whiskies to them - this being the only avenue of support available at that time.

Robert joined the police force at 19 and on his first day of training the recruits were taken to the city mortuary, a visit which left a lasting impression on him. The mortuary was then in the Cowgate part of Edinburgh and Robert also talks about the location of smaller mortuaries around the region, which are often attached to police stations or the local cemetery. After initial training in Edinburgh, Robert was sworn in at the Edinburgh sherriff court and then assigned to work in Prestonpans. After further residential training at Tulliallan police training college, Robert became part of the team providing 24-hour service at Prestonpans.

He recalls one death, a road traffic accident involving a young boy, which has always stayed with him. The boy, from Glasgow, had been on holiday with family and staying at holiday accommodation at Port Seton which, at that time, was a collection of old huts, train carriages and sheds and he recalls the poor conditions there. He remarks that Prestonpans was known as Dodge City at that time and recalls there was terrible levels of crime and poverty. Part of the problem centred around the Orange Lodge and their clashes with the Catholic population. Orange walks would often start at 4 or 6am and there was often trouble, which Robert found incomprehensible. Robert also relates a number of anecdotes about his first months in the force when, he later realised, he was often being tested to see how he would react in different situations or to determine how much he would put up with.

Towards the end of the interview, Robert again returns to the subject of dealing with terrible incidents, recalling one night he was called out to a fire in Danderhall where 3 children were trapped in a fire. The children couldn't be rescued and Robert remembered how the Inspector had opened up the local bar to serve up double whiskies to them - this being the only avenue of support available at that time.

EL153/1/5 interview 3 of 3. Note: this recording has been redacted as Robert recounted traumatic incidents encountered whilst on duty that cannot be published due to their content.

In this interview, (3 of 3) Robert Crowe talks more about his life as a policeman. This interview begins by revisiting a couple of discussion points from the previous interview. For instance, Shirley asks Robert about his comments regarding poverty in Prestonpans and Robert reflects that, although he was warned when he did his initial training that he would see lots of evidence of poverty, there was no training on how to deal with this. At that time, in the mid-70s, the only action he could take was to contact the social work department, but there would be no formal feedback about any outcomes and this was long time before the multi-agency approach used now was adopted.

Robert also recalls the general political climate in the 1970s, with 2 general elections in one year, the 3-day week and concerns about the spread of IRA activity in the UK. It was within this context that the new state-of-the-art police station was opened in Dunbar, and Robert recalls that many speculated on the reason for the construction of this high security building. Not long after this, Torness nuclear power station was built and Robert remembers the disquiet caused by the compulsory land purchase orders caused by this development, which put many smallholders off their land.

Much of Robert's career was spent with the traffic police in both the county force in East Lothian and the Edinburgh City force. He describes the specialist training that he had to complete in order to carry out his duties, which included being able to take photographs at the scene of accidents and being able to strip down a vehicle to ascertain if mechanical fault had caused a fatality. The roads heading south (the A1, A702 etc) were dangerous at that time and Robert could be called out to 2 or 3 fatal accidents in a single week on back shift and he talks about how he coped with these traumatic events. Robert was in the force for 24 years before any kind of counselling service was introduced and, although by then he had developed his own coping mechanisms, he thought this was useful for new staff who were encountering traumas for the first time. He talks about how the counselling service developed over time and the impact of other traumatic events, such as the Lockerbie air bombing.

Towards the end of the interview, Robert reflects on some of the happier times in the police force, which included participating in local community events such as the Fishermen's Walk in Musselburgh or visiting schools, and high profile occasions such as participation in the traffic detail during the EU summit in Edinburgh in 1992. He finishes by telling a funny anecdote about a very, very drunk man in Dunbar.